Star Wars Legacy of the Force : Invincible - Will Jaina Kill Jacen? February 2, 2008
Posted by showmescifi in scifi.Tags: darth caedus, invincible, jacen solo, jaina solo, legacy of the force, lucasfilm, Sci Fi, science fiction, sciencefiction, scifi, Star Wars, star wars legacy of the force, starwars
trackback
We’ve known since at least November that Jaina would be on the cover of the final book of the Legacy of the Force series.
Now the first images of the actual book cover are available and it looks to us that she’s going to have a showdown with her brother Jacen - Darth Caedus.
That is a confrontation that is - Inevitable - maybe that should’ve been the name of the book. Then again maybe Invincible refers to Jacen/Caedus….
Invincible’s release date is set for May 13, 2008. Amazon is already taking pre-orders on this the final installment of the Legacy of the Force - it’s a hardcover so it’s more dough than the paperbacks. Amazon currently has a neat offer though, they’re starting at 34% off list price and if you pre-order now they’ll give you an extra 5% discount. Sure beat paying full price the day it comes out..but i wonder if they’ll actually ship it to arrive on May 13th..
I don’t think so. By this book I see Caedus with more help and strength along with the ability to better control himself. After all he has to lead the galaxy…
I preordered the 6th Harry Potter book from Amazon, and got it the day it came out. It’s a pretty good service.
After I read the last book (revelations) I think that the question is nolonger will jacen win but how many jedi he kills before he goes and will they kill him or put him in a padded room
jacen cant die hes too cool
im hoping they pull a ulic qel droma and strip him of the force. that leaves things open for the future.
If caedus does die it cant be jaina by herself that is for sure.
You know what, I thought turning Jacen into a bad guy was a bad idea since the first book. Though I sort of had hope when it seemed like Jacen was doing this because he had to for balance in the force that has since been shattered. Jaina will kill Jacen, everyone will be fine with it, and the books will make lots of money. I’m just sad that it will be at the sacrifice of the best character to come out of the books since Thrawn…
The only (slight) hope is that Troy Denning will get his head out his A$$ and make the final fight a draw with the Empire entrenched on one side of the Galaxy and the UGA and Jedi entrenched on the other. There you have BALANCE and no ‘Anakin Chosen Darth whatever or Luke too good to be more then superficial’ character will have to be created to wipe the slate once again.
I see three options for the Jedi if they capture Jacen alive which I think likely if Luke pins him to his chair again. They can imprison him in some way, either in a cell or maybe in carbonite. Stripping him of the force would be interesting as it would leave an opening for future plots. Marooning on a distant planet that would be extremely out of the way would be even more interesting. I think also that Tahiri isn’t going to be Jacens apprentice but more of a “pet” and that Jaina will be the apprentice. Of course it could be the other way around as I can not think of anything more demented than imprisoning your twin sister and keeping her as a pet.
I think that Jaina might fail to kill Jacen and that it will be a final showdown with Luke, because in Revelation Luke literally almost destroyed Jacen in his stealthX so I think Luke is gonna try and bring Jacen back to the light side of the force like he did with Vader
You are right admiral wilhem. The NJO series started it all when it came to unpredictability. That was why I liked that series the best out of all of them. But thrawn’s trilogy was really good too. Chewbacca’s and anakin’s death made the series believable and gave you the scope of destruction and death that the vong brought to the galaxy. Death’s to main characters make the series’ rememberable. That is why some important character will die or do something stunning in Invincible.
I am almost certain that Darth Caedus will be the Invincible One though the Title Invincible may refer to the Jedi Order or maybe to the Force itself. The Sith and the Jedi both seem to be invincible since neither one can destroy the other for good, the good guys keep coming back and the bad guys keep on living no matter what. The Title does not narrow it down much since most titles are derived from a line or paragragh in the book. It may refer to the Universe itself in a way. There is a line in the Jurrasic Park novel where Ian Malcom scoffs at the fears of the lawyer that escaping dinosaurs will be the end of the world by saying that it would merely be the end of mankind which is far less than the world. It doesn’t matter who wins the Jedi-Sith war because life in the galaxy will continue regardless of who is in charge. So the Title Invincible could refer not to an individual but to a beleif or life itself.
Someone else posted on another forums that darth caedus may get stuck in time travel with jaina but jaina will break free and caedus will end up stuck in time travel. I believe would be a good set up for future novels.
If Caedus does get stuck in time travel, it would be better than killing off his character. Like you said darth skywalker, in the future novels caedus can be trying for a way to get back to the present, looking for revenge. Something cool would be instead of Caedus coming back to the present, he would follow the time line when he got “trapped” in time and find a way not to get trapped, and change the whole entire story because everything would be different if he came back through time the second time. Just something completely different in the EU of star wars books. But I don’t think that he will time travel when facing Jaina. When he is dueling jaina there is going to be know time to get into a “time travel” state. The fight will be feirce. The only time he would be able to time travel is if Jaina was actually listening to what Caedus was saying to her during their duel. He wouldn’t time travel to the past. There is nothing to show her there.
I wonder Caedus hasn’t looked into the future. He has that power. The only time that he did that was in Betrayal when he saw Sal-Solo bringing war to the galaxy and he knew he had to kill him. And with Nelani, not sure of her name right now. He saw that she would tell Luke about what happened on the asteroid and that Luke would die in the future by Caedus because of that. If Caedus could peek into the future, he could see outcomes that would help him achieve his goal. palpatine used seeing into the future. achieved basically everything from that. He planned out everything from that.
you are right Wilhelm. Invincible could mean so many different things. It was said when the series first came out that it was about Luke’s legacy and something about the Skywalker’s legacy going full circle.Seems like there is not going to be anything with Luke’s legacy because he is just going to sit back and have Jaina do what he should be doing. But hey, maybe Caedus and Jaina fight early in the novel, Ceadus beats or kills Jaina, then Luke goes after him in the climatic battle. Skywalker’s legacy full circle could mean just like Anakin Skywalker turned evil and ruled, his grandson Caedus turned evil and will rule.
in my opinion Tahiri will prove vital to the survival of Caedus in this final book Jaina will have Caedus down and ready to deliver the final blow as Tahiri steps in and mortally wounds jaina Tahiri will be the Jedi hunter/killer in future books fulfilling the role that Vader once occupied remember before anakin died he seen Tahiri in a force dream tattoed and menacing that may have just been a glimpse into what she will become as a sith lord…to be honest i saw this coming Tahiri since being changed by the vong has been an outsider and her being jacens apprentice gives her a sense of belonging again something she has been missing …im a bit biased towards tahiri
I think Tahiri will play a big part in Invincible. If she is around to help Caedus, she definetly will. Being a Sith does give her purpose. But I think that she will be in battle herself with other Jedi, possible Ben, when Jaina and Caedus are dueling. I heard people say that Tahiri is pretending to be Caedus’s apprentice. Don’t buy that at all. She killed Pallaeon in cold blood. A true Sith apprentice.
Does anyone think that the Vong prophecy has anything to do with Jaina and Caedus? I’m not sure…hmmm. I don’t think Tahiri is pretending…she also believes that the galaxy needs this balance/order that only a Sith Lord can bring. I think she is legit. It’s soo hard to tell what here role would or may be in Invencible, who would have guessed that SHE would become his apprentice let alone, kill Gil P. I hope her eyes turn yellow. What will Caedus do about Daala? She, of course, should not be killed off. She will be a very tough enemy to have especialy when she has such a repore with the Mandos. soooo many questions. What does Caedus have… some of the Emperial R. 2/3 the GA fleat…is that it? Who is against him…the Jedi, 1/3 the GA fleet, Daala w/ the Mandos, the Confederation…Only a powerful Sith Lord can handle those kinds of odds…As long as Caedus is constantly learning from his actions, controling his rage, and continues to fight from the front, all should be well for our new Sith Lord. Those guys and gals on Koriban have to GO!!!!
Maloch you bring up a good point with the whole vong phrophecy thing, remember way back in the beginning where there was a prophecy about someone bringing balance to the force in epsidoes one and two and mostly everyone believed it but yoda, and yoda doing his yoda thing by questioned it? Was the prophecy talking about anakin balancing it out because he was basically the Jesus of star wars? Or was it talking about someone else, maybe Luke? just a thought. I think Tahiri is not faking to be a sith app. because she is in love with Jacen’s dead bro and she wants to see him and allying herself with the only person who can show him to her I think it makes sense that she embraces the dark side. Now on to the main man himself, if the writers kill off Caedus I will be rippen mad, is he or is he not supposed to be the most powerful force user this galaxy has ever seen? So why the heck can Luke just show up and smack him around like he was some pup? I hate this I hope Caedus kills Jaina and Luke just like he did Mara I am tired of the old characters getting in the way. As for Jaina she is just annoying I never really like her. How the heck is Mando training going to help her against the most powerful being in the galaxy, I don’t care she got training from Fett I hope in this last book the final battle is so fierce between Caedus and the jedi he gets so mad he awakens some even darker power and kills them all off. Go dark side!!!!!
Luke is the most powerful force user in the Galaxy last time I checked. What Caedus has is not the raw power that Luke has but a greater variety of powers with more finesse. Luke could probably kick Jacens a$$ in a competition of raw power something Luke will not do because he fears falling to the Dark Side hence his being ‘weaker’ than Caedus. In a sword fight we know that Tahiri is the better fighter because of her Vong training which she integrated into her style in NJO. Luke may be The Last through whose eyes Anakin had his vision. Perhaps Tahiri kills Jaina and ‘The Last’ refers to the last of the good Solo children, Anakin died, Jacen fell to the Dark Side and is now Darth Caedus and so Jacen is dead. Jaina is the last Solo Child. Jaina is also Darth Caedus’ last link to Jacen and so killing her would be ‘The Last’ link Caedus has to his past as Jacen. I hadn’t even considered Anakin’s vision until I saw a mention of it earlier in this forum Thanks to whomever put that there.
Does anyone wonder if Timothy Zahn knew what a Pandora’s Box he was opening when he wrote Jaina and Jacen’s birth in The Last Command?
Don’t remember that vision from Anakin. Can someone tell me exactly what he saw? I am just excited for this last book. Here are some things that i think are going to happen. First of all, I don’t think the war is going to just end. So in saying that, Either the Jedi and new GA, along with Boba and company beat Caedus and set up peace talks with Confederation. Or Caedus wins the “last” battle aginst Luke, gets a devastating, crippling blow against federation, and sets up a new series where Caedus is cleaning up the last remnant of the confederation and tightening his rule over the galaxy. Along with the exert I saw with Invincible on-line, I also saw the list of people involved in the novel. And of course, that couldn’t be concrete. But there where no other Jedi involved beside Luke, Jaina, Ben, Leia, and Zekk. There was no kyp, Corran, or any other Jedi. So this last book will be dealing with just a close knit of people. Tahiri, hope she gets a darth name, finds the location of the hidden Jedi base. I foresee either Ben or Leia fighting her. Remember that vision Luke had of Han stabbing someone with a viroblade in the back saying you were family to me or something like that? Maybe that someone is going to be Tahiri. So if that happens, maybe Caedus wins and gets a new apprentice. Jaina or Zekk? And Luke’s force illusions. Is any one else sick of those? Don’t know why Caedus can’t figure them out. Luke gives jaina a force illusion of himself so Caedus thinks he is fighting Luke. Don’t like that at all. Better if Caedus knows its twin vs. twin. But that battle of course will determine the future of the series. Like someone said above, I hope Caedus looks deep within the darkside and becomes so powerful that he cannot be beat, hence Invincible. But with the book being short with only like 320 pages, its going to be action packed with a lot happening. Hope this book has many lightsaber batlles. Didn’t have many of those at all in the previous books. Hope at the end of the novel—once more the Sith shall rule the galaxy! And he shall have peace.
One thing I forgot to mention. Everything the tassels read in Betrayal came true except the making of the pet and he will know brotherhood. The pet could mean tahiri, either as a apprentice or someone that does the dirty work for Caedus. Thought earlier in series that the pet could have meant Alema. And he will know brotherhood. The only thing that I can think of is the Sith on Korriban. Believe they called themselves a brotherhood, so maybe they make themselves known to only Caedus and help him some way. The only reason why they would have been written in the series is to either help him or help secretly to defeat him.
the book in which Anakin has the vision of a dark tattoed vong like tahiri was in NJO-Edge of Victory -Rebirth…i believe
I’m all about Caedus and his becoming our new Dark Lord make no mistake, though, Luke Skywalker son of Anakin Skywalker, is the most powerful Jedi in the know galaxy. I didn’t like the fact that in Revelation, Caedus came to think that Luke just showed him all that he was capable of when our Lord was attacked out side of Fondar. It will be a grave mistake to think that Luke gave him his all and that it was all he had to offer. Caedus still has many years to grow to his full potential, which he may never reach. He may just go stronger, smarter, with new enlightenments. I may be going to far with that but, still and without a doubt Luke is still the most powerful in regards to power and experience. His only weakness is that he fears the dark side. And off the subject…does anyone writing here, live in L.A. ? I’m all about getting a group together for Aug. 15th. Check movie and talk Star Wars all muthakriffing day.
Just to touch on Sithspawns questions about the Vader prophecy: I believe that because Eps. 1 through 6, are about the rise and fall of Vader that he was the one. He just brought balance in a round about way, the hard way. The Republic was doing well for a long time before Lord Sidious, so the balance brought was the Dark side as the Light side was in power for such a long time. The balance: Light side rule for a while and then the Dark side gets it’s turn in the spotlight. And then with Vaders redemtion by Luke was the end of the Sith rule and now the Light side has it’s turn again. Just like the natural community of life: A population grows untill the food available deminishes and that feeder populations decreaces and as the feeder population deminishes the food population rises and as the food population rises so does the feeder population: balance. The same can be said about the Dark and Light side. Dark gets a turn and then Light get a turn. So in our series it’s the dark sides turn.
noone buy invincible or any other star wars stuff. boycott the movie and watch a different show when the new one comes out. i say if lucas says there is no expanded universe then we should stop giving the old prick our money. fuck u lucas.
also luke never had a vision of han stabbing someone. i think milshky makes shit up. anakins vision of tahiri was in the book before rebith. its the one where hes on yavin. he saved tahiri thus keeping the vision from coming to pass.
Hey darth who. Why would I make shit up for? Everything that I said on these sights I either heard about or read. I’m not one of these idiot fans who just make shit up out of the blue or say things that could never happen. I guess I was reading incorrectly in Betrayal, pages 332 and 333, when it said, Han, regret on his face, a vibroblade in his hand, lunged forward and slammed the blade between the ribs of a pretty young woman with dark hair. I loved you in my own way, I would have repaired the harm I did you. I DON’T make shit up. It was a vision of Luke’s. Will it happen? probably not. There were many dreams and visions in this series that will probably never come to pass. But thanks for the Anakin vision. I remember now.
Wow, it got all Democratic party in here. With folks bickering back and forth and not sticking to the topics that matter. lol. I think the old man was just talking about the extra movies i.e. 7, 8, and 9. Lucas was just saying, from my point or view, that he never intended to write a story after Lord Vader, cause the story he wrote had only to do with this great Sith Lord. I imagine the though of 7,8, 9 came from, possibly thinking that this story could be only be told with nine films and that probably got it’s momentum from a series that started with 4, 5, 6. We only thought go forward instead of going back to tell the begining of Anikan. Possibly. Never the less, I’m very greatful for a story that brought us the force and lightsaber and Jedi. Long live Lord Caedus!!!!
Hey Yo!!! I just found a spreadsheed made by Karen Travis and it contains the who Mandalorian language. http://www.karentraviss.com//Excel/MandoaupdateOct07.xls
Kriffing awesome!!!
Who cares what Lucas thinks of the novels after ROTJ. His movies were great and the EU books are all relatively good to great. If Lucas doesn’t like them, so what? the fans do. And I’m with you Maloch, Long live Lord Caedus. We are true believers of the dark side. And I do agree with you Maloch when you say Luke is the greatest force person alive. But he is followed only by Caedus. Thats why I’m disappointed because all indication is that Luke and Caedus will not face off again in this series. Would have been great. Does anyone think that Jaina can and should beat Caedus by herself?
To answer mliscky’s question: I do and don’t think Jaina should go after the Dark Lord alone, on one side, to her, it’s about bringing Caedus to justice and she wants him alive to be redeamed. This will take help and a good amount of it. On the other hand, it’s peresonal ( there twins, Lord Caedus killed there Aunt etc..) and I don’t think that Jaina wants anyone to see what she may become, even if it’s only temporary. Though, I don’t think at all that Jaina will beat the Dark Lord on her own, so her best bet would be to bring help. I’m almost thinking that this may turn out to be an intervention for Caedus as all his family might be there to try to save him.
I do think that Jaina should not go after Caedus alone. Just because she is the sword of the Jedi, doesn’t mean she has to face him alone. Alone, she cannot beat him. With someone or other Jedi, they can overcome him. Caedus is just to powerful for her. I read people talking about the Jedi focusing their will and power into her during the duel to help her win. Then she will be the “sword” of the jedi cuz the other Jedi would be weilding their powers through her.
I do believe that the only one who can redeem Caedus would be allana. Maybe seeing her while he is about to kill someone will dawn on him the monster he has become. Maybe he kills tenel ka and allana sees it and once again Caedus sees what he has become. Or maybe he even accidentally harms or kills allana, and just breaks down because everything that he done he has done for her. In saying that, I do not want Caedus to be redeemed or even be stripped from the force. for me its Sith or death.
Perhaps Jaina will be the Sword of the Jedi by acting as a channel through which the Jedi can assault Jacens mind with the total horror and fear that he spreads. He will have to realize his failures because he cannot shut off his connection to Jaina because she is his Twin Sister.
This will be the book where Caedus will show his ultimate power. I think the authors have been holding him back for a reason. Caedus has been showing power but he always had a defeat in every book. Which makes sense in a way because ultimately, its just him against everyone, including all of the Jedi. Now with sides being taken, Tahiri as his apprentice, and people done working secretly against him, such as Palleon and the “other” chief of state, Caedus can crush his opposition.
Can I ask a legitimate question? and please don’t anyone get angry cause i am just asking, but why is everyone wanting caedus to win? I am just wondering because I have always been a huge fan of the novels right from the very beginning. We have been following our favorite characters from the movies through all of the novels, through triumph and tragedy and slowly the galaxy was being rebuilt and the jedi were coming back. Of course there were huge bumps in the road caused by the yuuzhan vong war but we got through that, with losses, and again things were slowly being rebuilt. so, many of us have been following our characters in the books, struggling to make the galaxy a somewhat safe place, for years now, and if caedus wins and wipes our most of “the good guys”, i think that will be a huge let-down. To me i just think after following the jedi and other characters for literally years, it would be nice to have luke, leia and han live out their remaining few years in relative peace, before the galaxy spins out of control to the future shown to us in those new comic books. Anyways, for that reason i think that caedus will win and the empire will make some moves in order to progress the universe to where those comics pick up the story, which i’m not exactly thrilled with myself.
I personally usually route for the bad guys. It makes for a more intriging story line. But I was all for the “good” guys in the NJO series. Didn’t you think that ROTS, ANH, ESB, and ROTJ were alot more interesting than other movies or books written? Especially ROTS? I do because it was about the “bad” guys winning and trying to control the galaxy. That is why I loved the Darth Bane books because it was about the “bad” guys and the dark side of the force. Aside from ROTS, The Jedi have ALWAYS won. Sure they had many loses and defeats in the NJO, but when the series was over, they defeated the Vong. Just think it is time to shake up the EU books and have the Jedi lose to end a series, not win as they always do in every novel or series. And I’m not talking about the Jedi getting wiped out like they did in ROTS, just the book ending in a somber way having Caedus “winning.” What’s the point of LOTF if they have Jacen go sith just to have him die or get redeemed 8 books later in Invincible?
Thank you mliscky for your response, i appreciate the open discussion and you do raise some very good points. I loved ROTS, it was miles a head of the other prequel films and it was definitely the keystone that links all 6 together. It was deifnitley cool to see the dark side win and how that all happened but we all knew that was coming. It was deifnitley refreshing to see and have such a sombre ending but ultimately we knew that the dark reign would end in ROTJ, so we knew things would workout eventually. You are right for sure that it would be interesting to have Caedus winning and ruling for a while. You are also right with the series only being 9 books it does seem too quick to rise to power then be cut off one way or another. It might have been interesting to have maybe a dozen books or so spaced out in the timeline more if they wanted to wrap it up with a positive ending. I swear that I’m not a Happy Ending all the time type of guy even though i’m coming across like that right now. I guess my problem really lies with the time jump to the comic books where the galaxy is under sith and empire occupation 130 years later or whatever. I would be all for a period of dark rule with caedus if I ultimately had some idea that things would flip back to the good side way down the line and i’m sure it will eventually, but the darth krayt, jedi purge deal again seems somewhat like an endcap to everything that our characters have been working for and it was for nothing. They should be able to enjoy their old age for a bit in my opinion and who knows they may still have some good times under caedus rule. Anyways thanks for listening to me babbling on, but i definitley respect your opinions and deifnitley am interested.
The truth is that neither the Jedi or the Sith ever truly win. True both groups tend to beat the sh!# out of each other and from time to time they are down and out and bloody but both sides always come back so it is really impossible for either side to win since the goal of both sides is to destroy the other side. As long as the writers keep up the pattern of the Sith kicking the Jedi’s asses followed by the Jedi kicking the Siths asses neither will ever really win or lose. Caedus will kill many Jedi but he will never be able to get rid of all of them just as the Jedi Purge was unable to remove all the Jedi from the Galaxy and the Jedi have never scored a complete victory on the Sith of whom always two remain.
That’s my problem brad. The authors brought the comics into the EU books and I think that was a mistake. For we all know now that the one sith on korriban were the ones in the future comics. They take over and rule in those comics, so it will taint the future novels that come out because we know the way the galaxy will shape out. I always know that good will overcome evil, especially in books. But it is always nice when you have a evil person or a evil race, like the vong, that are powerful, unstopable, even murders’ and have the good overcome everything to beat them. NICE. Great reading.
Wilhelm, that’s the whole dilemma of star wars. You are right when you say the neither side can win. As we saw before, you only need one survivor of jedi or sith to keep the orders alive. And even if the Sith are defeated, you always have jedi that turn to the dark side for one reason or another, thus starting a war or the fighting again. Force users will always be around, therefore always jedi and sith. Might be considered the forces “balance.”
I hope Leia and Han’s parts are more involved. We haven’t heard really anything from then since they got Allana of the Anakin Solo. You would think that since it is their son who became a sith and trying to “take” over the galaxy, they would be involved in trying to take him out, however that might be. And I hope we see Caedus killing off some jedi or main characters. Propably won’t happen, but either Luke, Leia, or Han. Maybe Tenel Ka, Allana, Jaina, Zekk, or maybe Jedi masters. In this book we need to see his full power, his ruthlessness, and just being a evil ass sith lord.
I can’t remember if Daala ever found the person who killed her husband and gave her the patch on her eye. She said she was just waiting for the right moment for revenge on the person who did that. Or was it one of the Moffs? If it wasn’t a moff and someone in the GA, Maybe she might be the one to help Caedus with a surprising backstabbing. Then she will have her revenge in a sweet, sweet way.
mliscky you have a very sick and twisted mind. Han and Leia will never kill their own son even though he is now Darth Caedus. The most they would condone would be the freezing of Caedus in Carbonite and entombing in Mandolorian Iron (my personal favorite as it leaves the story line open for later development. As for the Comics and the EU you know that I am very opposed to the comics in general since like I said earlier all one has to do is draw a few pictures put in a little dialouge and look you have forever ruined the rest of the EU by killing Luke or revealing some other story. The Comics should restrain themselves and write only in between the books filling in little gaps in the story line like where Jacen went after the Vong were defeated.
wahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
time to change your tampons comic haters.
Hey now folks. Doe anyone know what’s going on with the Darth Plegious book? I’ve been looking forward to that for days ( forever ).
The comics. Uhmm, I don’t really think that they have to be tied to the books. They, to me, are to separate entities. So, I don’t think just because there something going on some hundred years in the future in the comics doesn’t mean that it should dictate what happends in the novels. And I’m not harping on comics either, just saying that is could be just that easy to keep the novels and comics separate. LOL to me, and again I’m not taking anything away from the comic books, the books can be the real story and the comics can be the what if’s. Are they not like that now?
So anyway. Let’s be done with the book/comic war or whatever.
We’re here to celebrate and speculate what is to come of our new Dark Lord, Darth Caedus.
Oh, and yes, some congradulations are in order. I now am a Dark Lord. thank you.
How do we put a picture up on this deal???
hahaha. lol. Congratulations maloch…er i mean Lord Maloch. What was your final test to become a Sith Lord? I think I heard that James Luceno was going to write the book, but for some reason it was put on hold. But I heard that a while ago. And I think i read it on-line so that could have been totally wrong.
Getting Caedus caught in carbonite is a decent idea. He then could be freed in the next series by his apprentice tahiri or whoever that might be. But to trap him will be almost impossible unless he is knocked out or really badly injured. But if badly injured, can he still live locked in carbonite? I’m leaning toward in this final book that Caedus will either die or win and rule as a new emporer. And you know which way i’m leaning toward.
Congratulations Lord Maloch on your ascension to Sith Lord. Will we have to refer to you as m’lord now or will Sir do well enough. Just kidding. I seem to remember the authors of the series saying that LOTF would give us more insight into the the workings of the Force am I halucinating about this please tell me cause if I am I need to start selling that stuff to the Jersey people here at college. If not the authors need to get busy because all I have seen in the series so far is more of the same old stuff that we have seen in many of the earlier novels, no new understandings no real revelations nothing.
Since you are a Sith Lord now can I apply now for a job as the Grand Admiral of your New Empire. (I beat Thrawn in a Chess match
I wonder if the Authors look at these exchanges as a source of ideas for future series and future novels it would be smart if they did.
Also a correction to my earlier statement I beat Thrawn in a dejarik game since the Star Wars Universe does not use Chess. I would like to get in my application now before the waiting list becomes too long.
Thank you both. I look forward to your commision Admiral. Along with you too mliscky. I look forward to the furture. The force is stronge with the both of you, powerful leaders you will become, and we shall have…peace….
mliscky, I was reading over all of these statements today and reread your entry on the Vision Luke had in betrayal of Han stabbing someone with dark hair. Unless Tahiri’s Hair color changes it isn’t her because she has blonde hair. This is not to say that she can’t disguise herself by dyeing it black but that doesn’t sound like Tahiri. My bet is that the dark haired one might be Zekk.
A matter of some interest in these discussions is the Comics of the EU. I have spent some time catching up on these particularly those set in the Future of where we currently are in the novels. I did not read the comics but have insted relied on online Summaries. It appears that the only way to reconcile the novels and the comics into a uniform story line is for Ceadus to be defeated. Jaina will have to live so that she can marry Jag Fel and have a son who will Become a galactic emporer. Ceadus must be defeated because the Jedi on Ossus are not defeated until the New Sith Empire one hundred years later. A sith lord does not let a Jedi Academy stand after he has defeated the best the Jedi have to offer (Luke) I wish it wasn’t so but after catching up on so much history and looking at the relationship between the Authors, George Lucas, and the Comic writers the only path I can see is Ceadus’s eventual defeat. Maybe not this series but definately soon.
I just had an awesome thought. The Star Wars Universe parelells that of Ancient Rome. In ROTS Darth Sideous says “I AM the Senate” This line and many others are taken directly from Shakespears The Tragedy of Julius Caesar. Sideous is Julius Caesar who was Killed by Brutus (Darth Vader) After which Rome returned to a republic for a time with both a Triumvirate (Jacen, Niathal, Cal Omas) (Octavius, Marc Antony, Lepidus) Lepidus (Cal Omas) was forced into retirement by Octavius (Ceadus) and Marc Antony (Niathal) was defeated by Octavius’s Legions at his home base in Egypt. (the GA government in Exile) (Marc Antony and Niathal are both better generals than they are statepeople).
Or Perhaps Sidious is Emporer Sulla defeated by Gauius Marius (Darth Vader) and Jacen is Julius Caesar (Defeated By Luke (Brutus))It is hard to tell since almost all the Romans set up Triumvirates, diumvirates and then killed or incapacitated thier rivals. But Definatley Jaina Survives, as Empress of the New Empire she doesn’t need alot of backround or strength as a character.
What you said about the EU books and comics is true. If they try to keep a decisive story line between them, it seems that Caedus has to lose in this series or soon after. And that pisses me off. In the books before this series, we never knew what was going to happen or where the next series and stories to come were going to take us. Which was GREAT. But from now on, we will know and the gay pictured comic books ruined it for the fans of EU. Yes darth who, the comics ruined the books. But i’m hoping that the books and comics are not a concrete story line. I haven’t heard any author or shelly shapiro say anything like that, so here’s to hoping.
Admiral, In luke’s vision it was a dark haired girl, so it couldn’t have been Zekk. But the way Zekk has been acting for so long, you could consider him a girl. lol. I will definetly be in your service, my Lord Maloch. What is thy bidding? I like your insight of ancient rome. very interesting. I believe Lucas stated that star wars was based on Greek mythology. I just had a thought. What if Caedus does die in Invincible, and is killed by Jaina. But in killing Caedus, Jaina turns to the dark side. If this would happen, everything could still fall in line with the story line. Jaina, as a sith or dark jedi, marries Jag and starts the new empire you see in the comics.
The Comics do not tell whether Roan Fel is a dark or light jedi all that I know is that the new empire under him is a good empire friendly to minorities and so on like the empire under Caesar Augustus and Tiberius, so maybe jaina doesn’t go all the way dark but becomes nuetral, unafraid of using the darkside but able to square it with herself and stay in the light to some extent being forever in Balance like that Mando Beviin. Of some more interest is the youtoob videos on Jaina. Very well done they make you think twice before dismissing her as a minor character.
Lord Maloch, Thank You m’lord for accepting my application for the job, my first project will be the rebuilding of an impregnable Death Star III (No annoying hatch covers that aren’t bolted down or anything like that. We’ll use the Verpine who will be enslaved to the Empire in Invinceble to design the important stuff and maybe cut a deal with the Mandos to provide alot of Beskar for armor.
mliscky we need to get an honorific for you, I have always been an admiral and our lord Maloch is now a Sith Lord. We need to give you a title like General or captain of Maloch’s Secret police. Something like that.
Admiral Wilhelm, I am greatful for you pledge, I trust you will honor our new movement to restore balance and a new future. I envision a way were we all will be able to embrace all the aspects of the force, dark as well as light.
mliscky, I sense the making of a powerful leader in you. Your reasonings are almost parallel to my own. Would you accept the title of General and lead from the front to combat any and all that stand in the way of unifyed peace and balance. What say you?….Gen. mliscky.
I shall be honored to become a General in your new movement toward peace. I accept my Lord Maloch.
I am anticipating lots of lightsaber battles in this book. Wonder who or what moffs will be heading the remnant empire? Should be interesting to find out. You guys think Tenel Ka will play an important role in Invincible? How about Allana? Denning should at least write Allana in because she is such an important character to the story line, especially to Caedus. One of the few problems I have with this series is that the authors never had the Jedi really try to go after Caedus and remove him from office. But is that because of jedi do not want to interfere with the politics of the GA? But in Revelation they have a chance to shoot him down and kill him, but they don’t. If that was any other sith lord they would have done that. When it comes to family, that is luke’s weakness. That is why Caedus should just tell luke that he wants to reconcile with what he has done, and when luke drops his guard, Caedus should put a lightsaber right through him. haha. Its just Luke is such a hypocrite at times.
It has begun. You know, I think that would be possible, the part about Caedus faking reconciliation with Luke, he has the strengh, though this is something that should only happen when Ben Skywalker has learned more from his father. The Sith will need a powerful avisary, and I see Ben being that person. I feel Ben will offer to us something that has never been brought, something that I thought Caedus would bring and, that is, a truly balanced force preception. One who embraces the darkside as well as the light. Something of what we, General mliscky, Admiral Wilhelm, will bring to the galaxcy, as different situations call for selected measures. We will not be heald back in fear of turning to one side of the other as Master Luke is. I feel this is something that the galaxy is longing for and needs and we shall bring this. I feel Luke must live only because he may still prove useful twards Bens accention as will others around him but, Luke, Luke is most powerful and there are still secrect that he hold that must be learned. Can you imagine what truths, revelations Luke’s Holocron holds?
Luke Has a personal Holocron?!!! When did this happen? Allana I beleive will play a very important role in Invincible. Remember the Jedi are relocating their base to that planet in the Hapes Star Cluster. Where I Tenel Ka I would send Allana to the safest place in the galaxy, right underneath of Luke Skywalkers powerful force drenched protective wing perhaps as a student at the Academy. This will ensure that she has a part to play if Jacen discovers the new base. Does he discover it I can’t remember it if he does or not.
It’s just speculation. Bane was on a mad quest to complete his holocron, so I would imagin Luke would have one. All masters should, in my opinion.
It would make a lot of sense to have one but I was under the impression that the technology required to make new holocrons was lost in Darth Bane’s time.
I hope Jaina is NOT involved with the Fel Empire. To me that would just ruin her character.
I’m hoping she tells both Zekk and Jag to take a hike after all this is done. Both relationships are BS now.
I don’t really care who is involved with the fel empire. Could even be offsprings of Ben or Allana. I’m still hoping that the EU books don’t coincide with the comics and their timeline.
I was just personally under the impression that George Lucas had decreed that no more main characters would die in this series. If true it just leaves the topic of what are considered a main character. I am split sometimes I think that it means Jacen, Jaina, Luke, Han, Leia, and Ben, but other times I think he may just mean the three movie characters as they truly are the “main” characters. What do you guys think.
George Lucas is not in command of the EU. He rejected the entire series of books and comics as not part of the actual Star Wars Universe. As far as I can tell it works both ways and the novel authors are free to kill anyone they want whenever they want. Chewbacca could have been considered a “Main Character” and look what happened to him in NJO. George Lucas Forfeited his right to order the authors around when he rejected their work as not part of his work. This statement though could be true FOR THIS SERIES are the Key Words It could happen in the next series.
Okay, thanks for telling me that i just had heard it somewhere and wasn’t really sure what it meant, so thanks for clarifying on it, and I like you guys’ ideas on what could happen to Jacen Solo. Carbonite is a very good idea, but I am thinking Troy Denning will probably pull a “Darth Vader” and redeem Jacen, but is to late to save him.
Save him physically is what I mean above at the end.
Oh and I must congratulate you Lord Maloch on becoming a Sith Lord since I wasn’t here when you became one,
I said this before, it is to late to redeem Caedus. That story was already written with vader/anakin, so denning should not write it again. Lets read something new. I wouldn’t mind if Caedus was on the losing side in Invincible, but escapes and lives to fight another day. But to write that kind of ending will be a tricky one. Still thinking the one sith on korriban will play a role with caedus, either help him win or help with his demise. Lets hope the sith stick with their own kind and help him.
You know Gen. mliscky, I was just thinking about that point about the Sith on Korriban. By ” the one sith ” I’m sure we both mean, the one that followed the meditation sphere..uhmm, remember that Lymina told the sphere to protect the Sith Lord to be? So, if the sith there do decide to assist our new Dark Lord, maybe it will be because of the sphere carring out Lyumina’s order or last request. Even if, the Sith on Korriban could possible have a greater influence over the sphere, than Lyumina, they still may decide to assist, thinking that it may be advantageous to them…but that in my opinion would be quite foolish…two reasons: 1. cause there can only be two and 2. because there old ways are finish and proven to be unstable to say the least..” to be united by hate, is a fragile alliance at best ” , Darth Traya. The Sith philosophy by design makes a sect of any sort impossible…impossible. They have little to no choice but to join Caedus and, first fight them selves to deside who will challange Lord Caedus, and then, ultimatly take there place by his side. Tahari, I don’t feel will be a match for these Sith on Korriban. I like her, to me it’s just….I just don’t think she’s stronge enough.
You know, I’ve just considered……why would that sith even tell the others about the sphere? Probably won’t. And if not, then, it the sphere goes along with my hypothesis, then maybe the fool may prove useful, just as long as there influence isn’t greaters that Lymina’s.
Thank you Cosal. If I may say, we look forward to reading you thoughts in the future.
Yes Lord Maloch, I mean the meditation sphere. And I swear, Denning better have a little part for them in the book or it was irrelevant to even mention them AT ALL. Lord Maloch, the thing about the one sith in the comics is that they do not follow the rule of two. From my readings on the internet, they seem to be a better version of the brotherhood that we read and heard about in Darth Bane’s time. But the “one” sith in the comics have one leader who makes all the decisions and has the respect that a master would have with a apprentice. The brotherhood in Bane’s time had a leader but it was almost like a democracy cuz the leader, Kaan?, always asked for other opinions when dealing with situations because they were all equals, but nobody is equal with the “one” sith leader. But what happen to the idea that the sith can’t share power because they all want the power to themselves? I have know idea. Maybe it is just a legion of dark jedi with a few sith lords.
We only have 1 more month left till the book comes out. OUTSTANDING. I am going to be so tempted to scan through the last pages of the book when I get just to see what is going to happen. I usually read a couple words here and there in the back of the books when I get them, but for this one I probable won’t because it will ruin the whole book for me. For Instance, if i scanned the Caedus died I probable wouldn’t read the book. So I am going to let the story come to me, Not “cheat”, and root for Caedus and the dark side. I am not going to even read the spoilers that are on the internet for a change. I basically found out all the spoilers in Revelation on the spoiler sites. Time for Caedus to be unforgivably relentless and evil if he is going to come out on top.
Just read a new blurb for a Invincible summary for the book. It hasn’t been confirmed so this could be wrong. And I don’t think that book summaries are spoilers. Everyone reads them before they read a book anyway. Here it goes: “Luke Skywalker is stuck on the horns of a dilemma. He is convinced that Darth Caedus, the Sith Lord who began life as Luke’s own peace-loving nephew, Jacen Solo, must be destroyed. Yet he worries that his vision is tainted by his own anger, pain, and desire for revenge. Jaina Solo, Jacen’s twin sister, has completed her training under the galaxy’s most fierce anti-jedi warrior, and now it falls to her to fulfill her destiny as “sword of the Jedi.” And so while the forces of the shattered GA struggle to end the civil war that has sent planet against planet, Jaina, along with her parents, Han and Leia, fellow Jedi Knight Zekk, and old friend Jag, heads right into the lion’s den to confront the horrific tyrant who was once her twin brother…”
The beginning part of the summary was just like the other one. But the last half is different. I definetly like this one better because it doesn’t have the part where it said that Luke gives her an illusion of himself to fool Caedus. Hate the illusion shit. And it makes more sense for Jaina to go after Caedus with more people than just herself. By herself, how was she even suppose to get to Caedus? There would be people every where. Now, the other people with her can distract the people around Caedus so she can fight him one-on-one. And the people that are supposetly going with her, make for a compelling, drama-sized ending. Han and Leia there. Can the parents really bring themselves to kill their own son, or let anyone else do it? That hesitation can bring Caedus a means to win the “fight.” And I said this before on this forum or another one, but with Zekk and Jag both being there, Caedus can use Zekk’s jealousy of Jaina and Jag to bring Zekk to his side. Remember, In Fury, Zekk was touched again by the dark side on Lyumina’s asteroid. Caedus can bring that dark side back by making Zekk feel angry and jealous. Caedus to Zekk, “Look at what Jag took from you. Your love, your life with Jaina. Look how they look at each other. He is the one to blame. Don’t hold back your feelings anymore. Unleash your anger on him. Take back what should have been yours first and forever.” Emotions will be riding really high for everyone involved.
General mliscky I like that summary and think that you could be definitley right about the Zekk thing because we are all speculating that Jaina runs off with Jag at the end, and Zekk’s confrontation with the darkside on the astroid couldn’t have helped him at all. Who do you think will be fighting Tahiri I think it might be Leia because that brief battle with her on Hapes could be foreshadowing at a bigger fight in the end. About the whole Sith on Korriban their little group probably won’t do so well be cause their is no trust among thieves or in this case Sith.
I went away for the weekend and I found a loophole that the authors can use to get around the comics. Ben Skywalker could marry Wyn Fel whom we met in the NJO series. For some reason Ben decides to change his name to Fel instead of using Skywalker to help him hide from Caedus or other Dark Side users. The Authors can then bring Col Skywalker’s story line into the fold by having a split inside the Fel Dynasty and the group that leaves reclaims the name Skywalker. It is a very roundabout way of bringing everything in line if Ceadus is victorious angainst both Jaina and Luke. Of course it would be easier for Jaina to be successful and then marry Jag, however unpopular this may prove to be.
” Time for Caedus to be unforgivably relentless and evil if he is going to come out on top.” this line is by Gen. mliscky, this is axactly what it will take for Caedus to bring balance. That’s why your awsome General and that’s also why you perfect for this cause, the cause being to bring a unifyed perception to the force. 29 more days. Who else will be taking the following day off?
I am hoping that Darth Caedus dies or is redeemed and I become the sith apprentice to Tahiri Velia.
I write allot of fan fiction too.
I really hope Jacen gets redeemed, if he does so I don’t see him returning as a prominent figure in the politics of the Jedi order or the GA. I see Jacen going into self imposed exile like Ulic did. The galaxy has seen enough death imo, I hope no more main characters die.
Everyone wants Jacen to get redeemed. Lets save poor Jacen and make him good again. Why? His character was always kind of boring, hesitant, and questioning everything that he did and what others did. But since Traitor, Jacen’s character became interesting and gave him purpose. Now with Vergerie’s, can’t think how to spell her name, teachings, he just choses and acts. This was his destiny from the beginning.
Let me asked people this. I was liking Jacen’s character since destiny’s way. Liked it even better in the DNT. Now he acts for a better tomorrow, instead of letting these politicians and rulers keep fighting and making wars between them. It just is never going to stop and Jacen knows this. Everyone is sick of it but only Jacen does something about it. So here’s my question: Why would the authors have Jacen go sith just to bring him back to the light? They wouldn’t. It is not his character anymore. He was changed into who he is now because of what he went through during the vong war. He was always looking for a better purpose and calling in the force, and this is it: To be a Dark Lord of the Sith, Darth Caedus. To bring it upon himself to bring peace to the galaxy. He believes that this his destiny and he would rather die than let somone tell him he is wrong and that this is not the way.
I started the books with Betrayl. It was my first Starwars book EVER. Then after catching up with the series and having to wait for the next book, I started reading from Traitor on up. I wanted to see why our new dark Lord felt that he was the only one to bring the balance. Now keep in mind that I’ve been into Starwars for a long time. Idea of the force and how it was explained that hooked me and then it was the charaters. And when, I started reading about a character that has been able to understand the force, by loosing it, it was very compelling. Darth Caedus only wants the galaxy to be united, to provide a safe place for his family and friends, by all means nessasary. To do this, one must sacrafice, and he has. To even think about redemption, or death would be a complete waist. There is a genuine chance for Caedus to create a safer galaxy and it’s not work for anyone but a Sith Lord. It takes a Lord of the Sith to burn the red tap and use the power to make thinks happen and not hope that it falls into place. It’s brilliant the way Caedus is able to pass up the senators and may things happen. I feel like I’m not making sence as I have to work but, Caedus is doing something that no one had the gumption to do. He’s looseing everything to make a better future for everyone. And all anyone can say is, ” he should be redeemed, he should die, he should be frozen and come back later.” NO! They need to get over the fact that he is a Sith and devote themselves to his cause instead of attempting to thwart his every move out of selfishness, and ignorance of the greater picture. Don’t stand in the way, make way or whether anyone likes it or not, Lord Caedus’s rule has been long in the making and he has enough momentum to stay the course and unifiy this galaxy for the sake of the future generations.
Now let just add…I don’t think there is ” one right way ” there’s no one way to make nests and there’s not one right way for spiders to make webs, beavers to make dams, or galaxy’s to be organized, though, there IS a way that works. And the way the galaxy has been, I don’t thinks it’s working. Caedus has a way that has worked before, and all the things that didn’t make it work, our new Dark Lord is aware of…it’s hard to do something all by one’s self, hence the need for a master or an apperentice. Now that Caedus has an apprentice and still listen to what he was taught by Verger and Lymina, he has a chance and he has a way that works well. We can only hope for the best…..now back to work!
Lord Maloch your right, Darth Caedus’s way of ruling the galaxy has worked before better than any other, and now with an example of how to do it and the mistakes to avoid that Palpatine didn’t see, he can make a new galaxy better than any other. Palpatine had the right idea for the galaxy just no one to follow so he had to carve the hard and unbroken ground of the empire he wanted, but all Caedus has to do is follow the path Palpatine was on and just avoid the hole Palpatine went down in. The other thing I was going to say is that we all know the galaxy has an order to it, for years at a time the light side rules, then the dark side has its chance at power, then back to the light, and now I think it is the dark side’s chance again we need to see a time when our invulnerable hero’s of the light get beat, taken down a notch, the books are more realistic that way and it makes you think the people aren’t always going to win so you keep thinking is this the last time for them? Don’t get me wrong the galaxy has had plenty of shakings with the YV war and others, but its been the same story for too long, the good guys always win, well I think its time for a change in that, who’s with me?
Cosal you are wrong the best way the galaxy was ever run was with the Old Republic. I mean look at how long it lasted.Look what it took to bring it down.
Exactly, “I mean look at how long it lasted.Look what it took to bring it down,” what did it take to bring it down? Palpatine took it down, but Palpatine’s was the most effective because there was no scrambling around with procedures before war was started, while in the mean time the galaxy was getting consumed, he just said go to war and it happened everything was organized, and no long boring political debates about power. In the very distant past of the old republic during the Mandalorian Wars, the Old Repuclic would have crumbled if not for the revan so, no you aren’t right it wasn’t the most effective it was just pure dumb luck and lots of skilled jedi that held it together for a long time and more than half of the time it nearly collapsed due to internal struggles.
There are different aspects of how to run a galaxy. Your right revanchist when you say that the Old Republic ran the galaxy the best. their was peace for thousands of years. You had your wars of course, usually started by the sith in one way or another, then defeated by the Jedi. And the reason the Old republic fell was because of palpatine/sidious. He started to get control of the senators, made them do what he wanted and eventually got elected chancellor. The galaxy was in a good state until sidious took it over. He took over the galaxy for his own personnal power and to eliminate the Jedi order completely. He ruled with fear and destruction. The sith way. When he was defeated, the galaxy never became stable again. War after war, bickering and bickering. Civil war after civil war. The galaxy is in chaos. And does anyone see that changing? No. The jedi can’t change it. Doing what Caedus is doing is the only way to change the galaxy. Jacen knew that and that is why he did what he did. Who is to say that the galaxy wouldn’t be better with Caedus ruling it? Can he bring peace without the fear that palpatine brought? Only time will tell. Caedus is Sith, so can he buck the trend of becoming totally evil like all Sith do? I don’t think so. But he is what the galaxy needs. The Sith shall rule once more and there will be peace.
We don’t know that, the Old Jedi told Revan to wait, which probably meant that they had a plan, and had revan listened we would not have had the new Jedi Civil War.
We can’t know that, but it doesn’t matter either way the Old Republic would have crumbled if not for the jedi.
Never forget the VT shootings on 4/16/07. HOKIES UNITED!
Don’t think the Jedi had a plan at all. That’s why Revan acted the way he did, just like Caedus. The Jedi are just pawns of the republic, in the old republic and during Luke’s reign as Jedi master. They never do what needs to be done, especially in dangerous times. They might say that they answer only to the force, but ultimately they answer to politicians and heads of states. They know what’s right, but they play politics. Guess that’s why they are not sith. They do not force changes for the better, just give suggestions.
Cosal, you are right when you say that the old republic would have crumbled without the Jedi. But those times have passed. Its been over 40 years since palpatine was defeated and it is just the same mess and chaos. Maybe even worse shape than palpatine’s reign. And you know and I know it was going to change anytime soon.
Correction things did not run well under the old republic. There was corruption and evil permeating the entire structure of the Senate and the Republic. The only thing holding the rotting deacaying corpse of government up was the Jedi Coucil. That is why the Jedi couldn’t detect Sideous in the force because the whole structure they were a part of was of the Dark Side, Sideous just blended in with all the other Senators. What the Galaxy needs is a revolution of the people for the people by the people. What the Galaxy doesn’t need is another war between the Jedi and the Sith like the one developing now. You would think that the population of the Galaxy having just thrown off the Vong almost single handedly with no help from the Jedi or the Sith or the New Republic would be feircely independent like the American Colonists after the French and Indian War. What needs to happen is for the Jedi and the Sith to both go into exile and leave the regular people to govern themselves. Perhaps a world that is populated only by Jedi and Sith that is interdicted and sealed off from the rest of the Galaxy. Perhaps Zonoma Sekot since Sekot is the most powerful force user in the entire Galaxy having an entire planet of beings with medichlorions to draw upon. Sekot would be able to keep both groups in line and can keep them out of Galactic politics. If the Situation called for it Sekot could release a few Jedi or Sith to help the galaxy in some way.
You are probably right wilhelm. But anyway, I’m tired of talking politics. Bores me no matter what. haha.
I believe it’s, Admiral Wilhelm, General….
Yeah Gen. mliscky politics are boring me right, now funny how we got to this when this is supposed to be about the speculation of Jaina and Jacen fighting… oh well.
It is impossible to seperate the two. The fight between Jaina and Ceadus will have far reaching political consequences. Power is the lifeblood of politics and both the Jedi and the Sith have vast quantities of Power. It is for this reason that both the Sith and the Jedi get involved in politics even though they would do better to stay out. When Mon Mothma speaks to Luke about the future of the Jedi order she points out that if you have power you will either be manipulating or manipulated no matter your values or beleifs. So we discuss politics here because, unfortunately, politics decides the future of everything.
Thank you Lord Maloch for insisting on Titles but since General mliscky is of equal rank I beleive this slip of the tounge can be tolerated. However the unranking members here should continue to show proper respect which they have done. All Hail Lord Maloch and I salute You General Mliscky for your dislike of politics though I do not agree with you all the time.
Insofar as main characters are concerned they (the authors) can do whatever they wish with any character that was written into the EU. As far as “no main characters” dying that is in reference to any character that was created by George Lucas himself. Essentially when the NJO was in it’s planning stages Lucas (either personally or through Lucas Licensing) gave them a list of choices for characters they could “sacrifice” and Chewbacca was the one that was chosen.
Luke will have to die eventually unless he is able to learn to use the force in such a way that he is able to halt the aging process. In order to do this he must have a meeting with Dr. DeGray in London (I think that is his name.) who has put together a list of things that cause human beings to die. Using the Force I beleive that it would be possible to conquer these things that cause us to die. But we can assume that Luke dies eventually because the comics have him dead somewhere in the future.
I wonder about this announcement by George Lucas that no more main characters will die off in the EU. Does this mean that he is going to make more films and is worried that the EU killing off his main characters will hurt future movies that no one will go to because they know what happens already.
Cosal do you go to Virginia Tech?
Comics and Book are separate entities. Comics are the what if’s, the books are what’s happening. Don’t take this wrong comic lover as I’m a fan as well and I imagine Comic readers may feel the same way towards the books but, just because Grand Mastere Skywalker is dead in the comic doesn’t account for what may happen in the furture of the books. And as long as we keep it that way so shall it be…
milshky and maloch need to get laid ASAP
wow enu already
I can’t help but wonder what the future will hold for US!? I mean we’ve been writing here for quite a while and with the last book just on the horizon…well any good Sith Lord, such as myself, has to look upon the furture, and we’ll absolutly talk about the last instalment for a time, though I foresee something more to come…..I will think on this some more. General, I hope all is well. Admiral, as alway great insight into our little universe and quit the historian if I may say so. I don’t want to leave our Cosal…any sugestions on what to do with this one??….and no disintagrations…..General.
I didn’t even see what Darth Who said lat time I wrote. ha! Maybe….but with all this planing to control the galaxy and speculations about the up coming book…who has the kriffing time?
Admiral just to answer your question above no I don’t go to VT, but all my family has, so it will always be close to my heart. Lord Maloch I place myself at your feet, you may do as you wish for your humble servant…. just to name something I am good at, I will tell you I am a good starfighter pilot so if you want you can look upon the ranks of Imperial starfighters and choose one you like, or you may choose something completely different for me, it doesn’t matter so be free to choose whatever you want.
Hey darth who, the only time you have to say something is when your trying to put somebody down on this site. If you don’t have anything to say about the upcoming book or something else positive, just don’t write anything. And who in the hell says “you need to get laid?” Lord Maloch and I probably get more ass in one weekend than you get in a year. Lord Maloch is a devious one when it comes to Jedi mind tricks, especially cuz he is sith. haha.
Read some sites where people were talking about alot of people dying in the final battle. Such as Zekk, Tenel Ka, Jag, one of the big 3, even Allana. People are also saying that Caedus will turn to the light side of the force because he will save Allana, thus turning him good again. Don’t buy Allana in trouble and Caedus saving her. People are trying to connect the whole vader saving luke, and Caedus saving Allana. First of all, Luke was actually going to die because sidious was force lightening his ass. So in saying that, nobody will be harming Allana in any way like that. Caedus already knows that nobody likes him, even Allana, so he won’t care if people turn away from him. That was one of his “sacrifices” that he made.
Thank you for your compliment Lord Maloch. As for what the Future holds I will be gone after May 15. My last Exam is that date and I will be leaving to go home. I do not have internet at my house (so I read History, Politics, Science, and Star Wars) so I will be out of touch. We could probably continue our discussions off this page through email after that but only once in a great while. As for the Future of Star Wars we have two paths to take. One that will comply with the future the comics have set up, or One that will deviate. This last book may turn out to be the deciding line. Do the Authors answer to the Comics AND George Lucas. OR just to George Lucas.
Don’t Mind Darth Who he is jealous and bitter at the fact that he was castrated by sheep he was trying to do. The Sheep didn’t like him either.
Lord Maloch, If Cosal Wants to be a starfighter pilot I would like to accept him/her into your imperial navy. If I may be so bold as to suggest Colonel Cosal or Col. Cosal for short.
Cosal please advise me of gender so that I can refer to you without having to type Colonel Cosal over and over again.
Admiral Wilhelm just to clarify on your question I am a boy, and I would be happy to join the starfighter squadrons as a Colonel, I thank you for seeing me as an able-bodied person to serve the Dark Lord I will serve you with my all and always be dependable. But first I must have the consent of the Dark Lord.
Hey guys just for the heck of it I have listed the Army Ranks and the Starfighter Rank equivilant for anyone who would like to see.
ARMY STARFIGHTER
Grand General—————–Grand Marshal
Grand Moff ——————–Grand Moff
Moff————————–Moff
Surface Marshal—————–High Marshal
High General——————-Force Marshal
General———————–Chief Marshal
Lieutenant General————–Marshal
Major General——————Vice Marshal
Brigadier———————-Flight Commodore
Colonel————————Group Captain
Lieutenant Colonel—————Wing Commander
Major————————-Squadron Leader
Captain———————–Flight Lieutenant
First Lieutenant—————–Flying Officer
Second Lieutenant—————Pilot Officer
Army Cadet——————–Flight Cadet
Admiral isn’t on there. Sorry about the confusion Col. Cosal I didn’t want to offend you by assigning you the wrong gender. I was pretty sure you were a guy but didn’t want to take the chance.
Hey Admiral thanks for making sure I was a guy because I know how embarrasing it would be to call a guy a girl, and the reason admrial isn’t on there is because it is the army and starfighter ranks not navy too. My first assignment as Colonel will be to recreate the 181st Imperial Fighter Group, and destroy Rouge Squadron.
This person…Joshdasmiter…had some very interesting points, which were writen on the former page…you may want to check it out. Joshdasmiter, had some things to say about the cover of Invincable..
Admiral Wilhelm…it’s unfortunate that you’ll be leaveing us, you would have been a great advisor, no need to flow walk when we had you to make sure that history wouldn’t be repeated…you knowlage would have proved invaluble to our cause. And I see we have a new Colonel…uhm, well I trust in our leaders to make the correct commisions..know that, when you do, you assume full responcability for there actions, good or bad…lets just hope that our new Colonel serves you well Admiral…
General mliscky, I’m sure you can make use of Colonel Cosal apon the Admiral’s discharge…most unfortunate discharge.
My vision is simple…create a new faction, that is recognize inside of our little part of the Star Wars community. This dream is still in it’s infancey…just wanted all to see that there may by a new Sith order to come and those who don’t believe will be encouraged to see the light..or dark.
I want to make some coments on the insight of Joshdasmiter…again very interesting and almost obvious remarks in regards to the covere of the new book.
Welcome Colonel Cosal. I’m sure you will prove yourself to be quite the asset. Looking farward to your insight towards the our future.
okay, i know im new here but i feel that i have read enough of your comments to ask a big question. But first some backdrop. Having never read star wars in my life, I picked up “Betrayal” last May and by June i had read all NJO and LOTF that was out. Jacen Solo is the sole reason i am reading these books. Everything about the books rocks but the whole story of him and the time with the Vong…well lets just say i dont move easily and that made me a believer in under a month. So naturally i DONT want Jacen to die, or be stripped of force or anything like that. So when i saw the jacket cover to “Invincible” i assumed what everyone assumes. The twins in the ultimate battle. Now if Jacen has to die i sure the hay dont want it to come from Jaina…If they truly must…Luke should kill Jacen, or even more in terms of Greek tragedy by Tenel Ka, but even im not that delusional…But for sure not some sister brat whose got less than a tenth of the power of Jacen. But i digress
Now for a question: One that may obviously be biased based on what i just wrote…… on the cover of “Invincible”….is that Jacen? Look at the hair. Its grey….like grey grey…. Jacens now got yellow eyes and a red lightsaber, but the hair really does look grey to me. Also, the background is not that of a star destroyer interior or some type of asteroid like ive heard the “final showdown” happening. Its blocky and stonelike. I smell Korriban.
“White Eyes” on Korriban has been manipulating Jacen from the very beginning. Remember in “tempest” when white eyes started saying MINE in force visions… Jacens got to figure out that he is being played…and then everything gets thrown at them. Jacen of course could never return after realizing what hes done so he goes into exile or something to that effect.
Remember Lumiya showed Jacen that a Sith Lord does not have to rule if the galaxy is in order already. (remember betrayal) if he is out of power i imagine the galaxy will stabilize itself and with that in a kinda odd way Jacen does bring peace to the galaxy by going into exile.
Okay, now to digress again. I am well aware that this is me seeing what i want to see….Jacen probably will die, and ill just shrug and say that it was nice while it lasted….but i still think that jacket cover convinced me that at least the prospect of Jacen not dying is possible. If i saw his face i would think differently, but that back headshot of….well maybe it is Jacen but i say no… is sneaky enough to work!
One last thing. Jacen said in “Bloodlines” that he would force walk and confer with his Grandfather after he became a Sith Lord. He officially is one now…and if he has to die i REALLY want to hear that conversation before he dies.
Hey Joshdasmiter, I remember seeing it on the official site that Sue confirmed the two fighting on the front are Jaina and Jacen, and the background is just a general background and has little to do with anything.
i know…like i said, im pretty sure at this point im just seeing what i want to see….but still….until i see jacen’s face or i read that jaina and jacen have clashed blades its my last shred of hope…a crazy person who knows hes crazy….i wonder what shrinks call that? Enlightened Insanity???
Joshdasmiter, I am glad to have you aboard. The old saying “Don’t Judge a Book By its Cover” is very true for the EU. Looking at the cover of the NJO book Rebirth for example we see Mara holding a very large gun and Luke with a Lightsaber. Luke nevers draws his lightsaber througout the entire book and Mara is bedridden. On the Cover of Revelation Jacen is shown holding his lightsaber in a combative stance yet he is never in a duel. On the cover of Fury we see Jacen holding an unseen enemy on the ground in a very metallic setting but Jacen is the one that is on the ground at the mercy of the Jedi multiple times. It could be that Jaina and Jacen never fight at all and the cover is just that way to sell more books. We won’t know until we get the book and read it.
Lord Maloch, thank you for your compliments but I’m not gone yet. It would be interesting if we all swapped emails or something like that so we could continue our discussions even after we fill this site up though a new site that periodically deleted the old messages would be Ideal. I Like the system they have here Perhaps the master of this site could set up a place for us? (by the way I have full faith in Col. Cosal’s Abilities) Perhaps we can find a new place before I have to leave.
On the bright side some minor details that you see in the backround play very important parts in the actual novel, or are the center of the novel itself. Also the covers could be more symbolism based rather than literal scenes. Jaina and Jacen fighting could represent the light and Dark sides fighting each other (nothing new) or some other nebulous idea.
you see? this is why there are others who read too deeply like me. So that we may counter one another until there is nothing to do but await the month of May and read the truth before us. Thank you for that as it makes so much sense about cover pictures….Yet even with everything i have seen there is one thing i remember above all others. Jacen chose the side of the dark to save Luke’s life. He ran every scenario he could and in every one he killed Luke. In the future it is possible that HE (Luke, not Jaina) kills Jacen. Now that is an ending that i can live with….happy…. never. but i can live with Luke doing that….. so i guess we just all wait. Glad to know others wonder too
Welcome aboard Colonel Cosal. I do agree with joshdasmiter. I said from the beginning that the cover of Invincible maybe is not Jaina and Caedus. I was thinking after awhile that it might be Jaina and Tahiri. I know Tahiri is blonde but maybe she has dyed her hair for a mission so she is not so recognizable. I never heard Sue say that it was definetly Jaina and Caedus on the cover, just Jaina was on the cover. Everyone just assumes that it is Caedus. And i have been thinking just like you joshdasmiter that caedus could still lose but bring peace to the galaxy then go into exile. But i just don’t think that will happen. He can maybe bring peace to this conflict but a year from then bickering and war again. He won’t take that chance. Also coming to think that maybe Jaina and Caedus will fight midway or 3 quarter of the way through the book, defeat Jaina, not kill her but defeat, then Luke will face off with Caedus. And listen to this:Luke and Ceadus duel to the death, during the duel Allana sneaks into the room where they are fighting. In Luke’s rage for Jacen for all that he has done to him, Luke turns to Allana and tells Caedus that he will take from Caedus what he took from him. So Luke goes after Allana to kill her and Caedus intervines to stop him, thus turning him good again, (the redemption story everyone wants for some reason), and sacrifices his life for his daughters. And the Skywalker legacy comes full circle when Luke becomes dark again.
General mliscky that is a very interesting theory about Allana sneaking into the room then Caedus saving her (even if I don’t really want a redemption), but I really don’t think Luke would kill an innocent girl even out of revenge, he has become to much aware of the light and darkside. I do think Allana will play a much bigger role in this book though, because we haven’t seen enough of her throughout the series, and possibly Caedus just seeing